By Dan Horn
The Cincinnati Enquirer

Officials at the Hamilton County Coroner's Office knew all along that Thomas Condon wanted to take posed photos of bodies at the morgue, according to a taped conversation between two employees.

A transcript of the conversation, filed recently in federal court, suggests that morgue officials were aware of Condon's interests at least a year before he was criminally charged for taking photos of bodies posed with toys, sea shells and other objects.

A pathologist at the morgue, Jonathan Tobias, was later charged with helping Condon gain access to the bodies.

The tape is significant because it indicates that Tobias was not the only morgue employee who knew about Condon's interest in photographing bodies.

Terry Daly, an administrator at the coroner's office, states on the tape that several morgue officials learned of Condon's plans when they met him in 2000 to discuss the photographer's possible role in production of a training video.

Daly said Condon came to the meeting with a book of photos that other photographers had taken of dead bodies. Condon said he hoped to do similar work.

"Didn't (the video producer) know that Thomas had an interest in doing this stuff?" asked Deputy Coroner Gary Utz, who taped the conversation with Daly.

"We all did," Daly responded. "That ... book was in that first ... meeting and everybody in that ... room looked at it."

Daly, who declined comment Tuesday, did not say on the tape whether Coroner Carl Parrott attended that first meeting. Parrott, who could not be reached for comment, has previously said he does not recall whether he saw Condon's photo books.

The taped conversation now is part of a federal court case involving families who have sued the county, claiming morgue officials allowed Condon to photograph the bodies of their loved ones without permission.

Utz declined Tuesday to say why he taped his conversation, but said it took place at the morgue in January 2001. At the time, prosecutors were questioning morgue employees about how Condon got access to the bodies. No one on the tape says Condon was given permission to take the photos.

Condon argued at his criminal trial that he told morgue officials about his plans for an "art project" involving photos of bodies. And Tobias complained that his supervisors knew what Condon was doing.

"It's clear that people were aware of it," said H. Louis Sirkin, Condon's lawyer. "He wouldn't have done it if he didn't think he had the right to do it."

Condon and Tobias were convicted of gross abuse of a corpse but are free pending their appeals. Condon was sentenced to two years in prison and Tobias was sentenced to five months.

To Stan Chesley, the attorney who is suing the county in federal court, the tape proves Tobias was a scapegoat for higher-ranking county officials. "This case ... is about a cover-up," Chesley stated in a legal brief filed last month. "One or more persons within Hamilton County government put in place an invisible shield to protect all other county employees except Dr. Tobias."

The county's attorney, Louis Gilligan, said county officials acted appropriately. "There wasn't any cover-up," he said. "There was no discussion about Condon asking permission or being given permission at any time to take these photographs."

Gilligan said the meeting mentioned on the tape was about the training video project - not Condon or his photo books. He said Condon may have talked about his interests, but it was "a non-issue" to Parrott and other officials.

The video producer, Ernie Waits, said Condon showed morgue officials several photo books at the meeting and expressed an interest in doing an art project involving bodies at the morgue. "Everyone knew the nature and the type of photos that Thomas wanted to take," Waits said Tuesday.

In their taped conversation, Utz and Daly said they were surprised to learn that Condon had actually taken the kind of photos he had talked about earlier. They also speculated about which morgue employees might be punished for helping him.

"The last thing we want to do is blame Jonathan (Tobias) for this," Utz said.

"(He) could lose his career as a doctor over this whole ... thing," Daly said.

E-mail dhorn@enquirer.com